Mohamed Ali El-Hamamsy: It is all a matter of maximising whatever potential you have Sketches from life Profile by Yasmine El-Rashidi

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Mohamed Ali El-Hamamsy is not quite what one might expect of the former CEO of two giant multinationals. His door is always open, he smiles shyly and a lot, and as he speaks he constantly fiddles with paper clips.

"I'm a modest person," he says after being prodded about his low-profile reputation. "The thing is," he says, looking down at his fingers as he unclasps two paper clips from each other. "Life turns."

El-Hamamsy pauses, takes a piece of paper from the pile on his desk, and draws a circle with dots scattered along its circumference.

"I happen to be up here professionally," he resumes, pointing to the uppermost dot, "but it's important not to walk too tall when you're up there because the circle keeps turning and one day I'll be down here, and when I am, circumstances should not change me. I should be walking just as tall, because worth comes from inside not from your title."

These days El-Hamamsy's title is deputy chairman of Vodafone Egypt. A chosen step down from his former posts as CEO of two global telecommunications corporations.

"I'll be down here one day," he says, circling the bottom-most circle, "and at that point I will need to look at myself and ask, 'Am I a worthy person?' If you're worthy from within, then what's on your business card -- if you have one," he chuckles, "doesn't really matter."

"If you looked at my professional history, or that of any CEO really, it looks like it's all planned and that you just need to follow a certain recipe," he says, pausing and leaning back in his chair. "But it isn't like that at all. It is really the result of a lot of hard work."

And a rigorous education and upbringing.

"I was lucky to go to a French school. And the French Cartesian way of thinking -- which is the logical rational way of thinking -- is something that to a large extent is not followed by many of our compatriots, so that gives you an edge because you are logical and rational -- which is very important. We are not in a society that is driven by rationality and so if you are you have extra tools."

He pauses to take a breath.

"I come from a family of driven people with a very high level of integrity. Not just ethical integrity, but also intellectual. Parents," he smiles, "for whom you had to perform well, for whom mediocrity was not at all acceptable. They set very high standards for us, and so my brother and I were always striving to give everything and do the best we could."

The result, upon graduation, was a spot at IBM Egypt -- a place that became El- Hamamsy's finishing school.

"I was very lucky to work in a company like that," he says, reflecting on his climb up the corporate ladder. "It's a school, they have principles and traditions, excellent work and business ethics, and a super corporate culture which was ingrained in everyone. And of course there were excellent role models."

But there is more than 30 years of hard work in the equation.

"Luck, of course," El-Hamamsy says, a slight French accent inflecting his perfect English. "You can have all these things and be very well prepared but circumstances may be such that there is no opportunity to advance or take up a challenge. Luck is a critical aspect of a person's success; being in the right place, with the right preparation at the right time."

But that, he emphasises, is no reason to sit back and leave the turning of life to the fates.

"As a matter of fact," he says, re-adjusting himself in his chair, relaxing his shoulders and leaning forward on his desk, "you can make your luck. There's no point in sitting back and waiting for luck to come or not. No," he says firmly, picking up pace, "opportunity will knock at your door, and it will not knock a thousand times. It will knock just two or three times in your life and you have to be prepared for it, you have to work hard for it, you have to be worthy of the opportunity that is presented.

"It is people that give value to life. As individuals we have to value ourselves, and within corporate culture we must emphasise that value.

"Organisations and systems are people. A lot of the time I hear people say that multinational corporations succeed because they have systems. Yes they have systems, but so do the bureaucracies -- they have systems too. Why does it work less well if you want to do some transaction with the public sector then with the private sector or multinationals? It's because of people. People make the difference. In Egypt, for example, we have very good laws -- very good banking laws. But implementation, which is done through people, lessens the effectiveness of these laws.

"Wherever I've worked I've been keen on making sure I have the right people with the right potential and the right training. And that's not a matter of luck or connections. It's about nurturing tour people to value themselves and their time. That's what success is -- instilling in everyone the desire and drive to reach their maximum potential. You do that through training people, giving them opportunities, promoting based on merit rather than seniority, and paying based on performance rather than seniority.

"I stayed with them for 30 years -- in Cairo, Saudi Arabia and the European headquarters in France," he says.

"What happened after that?" The question is rhetorical, despite a pause during which he appears to be delving into past thoughts.

"Well," he resumes abruptly. "I always admired people who worked on their own. For me, the grocer who has to fight for his livelihood, who is solely responsible for the success or failure of what he does, has always been an admirable figure. I had never tried it, and so always had a special respect for people who take charge of their lives in that way, who just go out and do their thing. So after 30 years I felt it was time."

It was 1997 and Egypt's economy was enjoying something of a boom -- foreign investment was flowing in and the IT sector beginning to blossom.

"So I established my own company offering management consultancy and IT services, and I worked there for a couple of years."

Opportunity, however, knocked again when El- Hamamsy was headhunted for what was to become Egypt's second mobile communication provider.

I mention the word disciplined -- one word family members, colleagues, and acquaintances repeatedly use to describe El-Hamamsy. He laughs.

"My wife always complain about that," he says, with a loud smile. "Let me show you something," he says, taking the scrap paper again. "I really don't care about taking credit for ideas and projects," he says as he begins to draw. "What I care about is if we can get things out of the door and implement them. That's what gives me satisfaction."

The drawing is of stick figures.

"Part of your sense of self-worth is that you have to be a person who is reliable, when you say something you execute it, when you have a commitment you follow it through -- there are no ifs and buts about commitment, whether it is to someone else or to something you want to do or change or accomplish for yourself.

"And of course I expect the same of my children," he smiles, nodding his head. "Not accepting less than your best can get molded into you. My belief is that in life we have to focus on results and not on processes. One of the weaknesses we have as a culture is that we are far less result driven than we are keen on ensuring we cannot be held liable for anything.

"You can't just 'do your bit' and then say that you're not responsible if it doesn't go exactly according to plan," he says. "So the house has burnt, so what do you do now? You may have taken precautions but now there is a reality to deal with," he continues. "It's not about the Machiavellian approach, about how the end justifies the means. It's not about this at all. But you must achieve results. And you should work as part of a team."

He turns back to the drawing.

"This is my favourite," he says of a tilting boat.

"There is one person here with a bucket," he explains, pointing to the sinking side of the boat, "And there are many people up here. They're all sitting watching him trying to take the water out of his side of the boat with his little bucket. And they're all watching him, and saying 'thank God the hole isn't on our side of the boat'."

An anecdote, he says, which is unfortunately characteristic of a mindset manifest in the culture.

"The boat is going to sink anyway. So why not focus on the desired result, and once it's achieved then you can worry about taking credit or seeing who the bad guy is. But you shouldn't decide that if you don't get credit you won't help. That's the disastrous thing about team work here, and that's why as a country we're not progressing as we could.

"I can't carry this table alone. Neither can you," he says, placing his hands firmly on his desk.. "But together we can. But instead, if you look around you, you will find that instead of 1+1 equaling work done you get this." On the paper is written 1+1= -1.

"Because when you come to help me you say do this and that, go this way, not that way. And instead, I end up saying 'no, I'm not going to do it, you're bossy, I don't like your way.' So it's not only that we end up not achieving anything, which is the zero, but we both go away with negative feelings, which is the minus one."

Not a problem El-Hamamsy has had to face within his work environments.

"It's a matter of examples and the role model you give to people," he explains. "If you trust people, tell them about these things, teach them what you know, then they learn."

El-Hamamsy is enthused as he speaks -- the paper clips are now on the paper while his hands move to emphasise his speech.

"People learn behaviour from how they see you behave. They learn from hearing how you talk about people when they're not there, about achievements and the things they've made happen. And so they learn that this is the right way of doing things. It's the language of behaviour. Behave constructively and people will follow."

His family is included in the package.

"I encourage my children to think about things and how what they're doing fits into the bigger picture," he says of his four children. "To fulfil ourselves we must achieve our maximum potential, taking into consideration that potential varies from person to person. If your potential in X is medium, then you have to achieve that medium. If your potential is high then you must achieve that high. If you don't then you are not the successful person that you could be. And what you have to do is find out where the potential of the person is, and encourage them to achieve this particular potential."

His children, he points out, all have the potential to be excellent in something.

"I'm quite difficult about that," he laughs. "My daughter used to play tennis. She was talented but she was never going to be a Kim Clijsters," he says. "But she was good, so we encouraged her to work hard and give everything she had. We didn't expect or want her to be a Kim Clijsters, but it was not acceptable for her to miss every ball. It wouldn't be right."

"I expect of them what I expect of myself," he says. "Whether it's law or art I expect them to give everything they can to achieve their maximum. In my mind that's what life is about -- making the most of what you've been given. And of course this element of individual worth is very important. I play golf with my wife. We go on skiing vacations as a family. Our time together is high quality. I don't want to go on a trip and go off and play golf while my wife waits for me in the hotel. We do the things that we can do together."

That commitment to people and individual nurturing is one that is playing a key role in El- Hamamsy's current post.

"I was re-hired as a consultant to help on strategic matters and to set up a developmental charity foundation, and to float the company's shares on the Cairo Alexandria Stock Exchange," he says. "The money put into the foundation is directed towards children's health and education."

This year's projects include putting money into the Special Olympics -- to offer children with disabilities the opportunity to play sports -- Volunteers Egypt, a programme that shows young people how they can positively channel their energies through volunteer work, and Al-Nour wal- Amal, an association that aims at empowering blind women through activities.

But El-Hamamsy has other priorities too.

"Islamic architecture is a passion," he says.

"It started when we were living in Paris. And it was always very embarrassing that when we were driving by any taxi driver could tell you about any building and who built it and why and when, as well as the history of France. I, on the other hand, was not even aware of where Sultan Hassan was, or Ibn Tuluun. And it's embarrassing that foreigners in Egypt knew more about it than we did. It reflects a lack of pride in our own culture and heritage. So I decided that I needed to start with myself, and when we came back I decided to attend a couple of classes at AUC."

The few classes turned into a master's degree in Islamic Art and Architecture.

"Cairo is so rich, Egypt is so rich. In one very short street -- Shari' Al-Mo'ezz -- you have 900 years of art history. There is no place in the world like this," he says. "Unfortunately I have less and less time to attend lectures so I do what I can in my own way." Which includes his company subsidising restoration work in areas like Bab Zuweila and projects like the refurbishment of the Gayer Anderson House.

"As I said," he reflects, "when you do something, whatever it is, you must give it all you can. And it's important that you don't constrain or limit your life to work. You should have other interests outside work because if you don't excel professionally you must still have self-worth. And since success is to a large extent linked to opportunity you must still be worthy even if you don't end up at the top of your corporate or professional pyramid. Because you have to remember," he says, slowing down and articulating his words, "only one person can be at the top. And if you're not it does not mean you're not worthy or successful. But you have to know you have given it your best."

He pauses, glances up at the clock -- now slightly past the time allocated for the interview -- and opts to continue.

"I know people who birdwatch," he says quickly. "They travel all over Africa and to them the fact that they have seen a particular species in Ethiopia, or seen 1,512 species compared to someone else who has seen just 1,503, is a most fulfilling thing. Which is wonderful," he says, his smile widening. "No they're not crazy because it's about their interest and talent and individual goals. It's not about what other people want you to be doing. It's about you and what you are good at and what you enjoy. It's about you, as an individual, feeling fulfilled."